tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1262631126788882699.post5142616298021377676..comments2023-09-30T08:13:47.719-07:00Comments on AYN RAND: ZIZEK: The Actuality of Ayn Rand: Journal of Ayn Rand Studies; vol 3;no. 2 (Spring 2002)seymourbloggerhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02843717286012748265noreply@blogger.comBlogger248125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1262631126788882699.post-4736357846215473622014-02-27T19:47:41.637-08:002014-02-27T19:47:41.637-08:00I have read it as well as most of Herman Hesse, al...I have read it as well as most of Herman Hesse, along with the Vedas and Upanishads.John Gregornoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1262631126788882699.post-7733367795886392812013-05-24T21:04:27.353-07:002013-05-24T21:04:27.353-07:00Not always, but often Capitalism necessarily explo...Not always, but often Capitalism necessarily exploits human labor to provide a good or service. The humans are expendable and can be replaced if they don't produce in the required way. Is not altruistic. There is certainly an exploitation of human labor historically as practiced by Capitalists in the USA.Daisy Dukenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1262631126788882699.post-52082997838260233872012-06-18T01:55:20.704-07:002012-06-18T01:55:20.704-07:00Well if it has then I want some.Well if it has then I want some.abbeysbooksnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1262631126788882699.post-29130591051550482452012-06-18T01:55:12.340-07:002012-06-18T01:55:12.340-07:00No, I'm not devaluing. Beeing there doesn'...No, I'm not devaluing. Beeing there doesn't mean knowing. Yes, growing up under the communism has affected my life. But beeing there doesn't mean I understand it. Many who have been there as I was still can't tell the difference b/w communism and socialism. Now I'm feeling that I'm stating the obvious. Shouldn't this be obvious?<br /><br />There was a subject we had in school, marxism. Beeing there doesn't mean I took anything from the classes.Which I did. Beeing there for other people doesn't mean that they took from the classes what I did. Beeing there doesn't mean they understood it as I did. Now we may argue over our understandings of marxism or whatever, and they tell me, well, that's the way you see it, this is the way we see it. If I was interested only in the way I saw it, then I would have still believed what they taught us in class. <br /><br />It's much easier to be interested in how you understand things, have them defined and not face the figurative pain of realizing that the thing defined contains the multitude of the undefined which is crucial to the understanding of the thing defined as well. Yes, there's a chemical reaction behind petting a dog. It's all chemistry. But what then? Does the fact of chemical background make me pet the dog better? Or worse? Or do I enjoy it more if I know of chemical background? Will it make me feel more of an animal lover? How will the dog feel? If I pet the dog does that mean I like dogs? Or am I just being polite, or frightened but too ashamed to admit it?....Chemical reaction doesn't answer a multitude of these questions that also define petting a dog.<br /><br />And to your last sentence.<br />But no one is closing their eyes. What YOU read when you read 'Rand is postmodernist in her thinking' is not what Janet is saying. YOU read it as Janet using labels and it's not. YOU go out of your way to ascribe the hidden meaning to Janet, then to psychologize to 'reveal' the intention behind it, when it's YOU, just YOU who is ascribing meaning to everything. Again, I refer you to that palympsest reply re posmodernism. And Barthes's the author is dead. And Maigritte's painting of a pipe which is not a pipe. And Žižek above all who wrote over 1000 of pages on twisting and turning and falling through layers and writing down all of this which is undefined, unable to be encompassed by language, but very defining. <br /><br />Be flexible. What you're reading is only what YOU believe you're understanding. It's not necessarily what the thing IS. So everything that you're not understanding, not getting because you're believing a thing defined, settled, emboxed in the meaning you ascribe to it, is as crucial for the understanding and needs to be taken into account. Which is a major change in a way of thinking. Janet said it above, spiraling.curioushairedgalnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1262631126788882699.post-78098857921467954042012-06-18T01:54:54.030-07:002012-06-18T01:54:54.030-07:00CHG wrote:
"Yes, eyewitnessing is that '...CHG wrote: <br />"Yes, eyewitnessing is that 'one's been there' but it doesn't actually MEAN anything. Beeing there doesn't mean knowing." (end quote)<br /><br />But aren't you devaluing personal experience by stating that being there doesn't MEAN anything? <br />Hasn't your first-hand experience of life under a communist regime had a profound influence on your life? <br /><br />CHG wrote: <br />"Other two quotes u used are not me, but Hassan." (end quote)<br />Sorry about my sloppiness. I overlooked that you had clearly marked <br />them as quotes from Hassan. <br /><br /><br />"I don't know what would we do with the labels, you seem to be the one having it all (the pomo) grasped ie. labeled."<br />(end quote)<br /><br />But we can't close our eyes to the fact that labels are being used in this discussion, like e. g. Rand being called by Janet a "postmodernist in her thinking".Trafonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1262631126788882699.post-45138817766556183562012-06-18T01:52:09.958-07:002012-06-18T01:52:09.958-07:00Deja vu is described as an out of synch moment bet...Deja vu is described as an out of synch moment between the two halves of the brain.abbeysbooksnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1262631126788882699.post-35468106137731031442012-06-18T01:52:09.446-07:002012-06-18T01:52:09.446-07:00The point is that there isn't any comprehensiv...The point is that there isn't any comprehensive model of post modernism. It's much more of an intellectual Event that is spiraling outward into the ether. Even Zizek in his Hegel argues against it (see x-ray why you will want Hegel in bed with you at night!)and seems to me to miss it. Of course Zizek is going up against Foucault, Baudrillard, etc without going up against them, but by making Hegel and Lacan more radical than they are. <br /><br />Badurillard is the consummate outsider though. Hard to get him in any net.abbeysbooksnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1262631126788882699.post-92008297788262607532012-06-18T01:51:33.527-07:002012-06-18T01:51:33.527-07:00The Freudian interpretation would be the unconscio...The Freudian interpretation would be the unconscious. Malabou is suggesting something different in her neural cognitive work on the plasticity of the brain. You would like her. I have just looked at her briefly since I keep tripping over her name all the time.<br /><br />Zizek has much to say about the "self" which would interest you. Pages 716 - 18 is one place I found his sort of genealogy of it. You need to own this book.abbeysbooksnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1262631126788882699.post-72893578069246883722012-06-18T01:50:01.707-07:002012-06-18T01:50:01.707-07:00You are stating the obvious.
Yes, eyewitnessing is...You are stating the obvious.<br />Yes, eyewitnessing is that 'one's been there' but it doesn't actually MEAN anything. Beeing there doesn't mean knowing.<br /><br />Other two quotes u used are not me, but Hassan. I don't know what would we do with the labels, you seem to be the one having it all (the pomo) grasped ie. labeled.<br />The point is exactly that, there's the word, the label of postmodernism and there's everything that is not encompassed by the word which also needs to be known or considered if one is, as you say, to be flexible.<br />Do you remember what was the point of this conversation, how it begun? Cause i don't.curioushairedgalnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1262631126788882699.post-90424781266021656362012-06-18T01:49:23.387-07:002012-06-18T01:49:23.387-07:00We are the known and the unknown having a conversa...We are the known and the unknown having a conversation.<br />You seem to me to be measuring everything by what you know, what you have experienced/learned because that is logical, right?<br />I prefer for measure or evaluate on what i dont know, have not experienced/learned and may never know. This, to me, is more logical.kidkennedynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1262631126788882699.post-168533237931272592012-06-18T01:48:55.044-07:002012-06-18T01:48:55.044-07:00CHG wrote:
"What does my speaking from the ...CHG wrote: <br />"What does my speaking from the personal experience with the version of communism I had imply? " (end quote) <br />For example, it gives your statements eyewitness quality from someone who has "been there". <br /><br />CHG wrote. <br />"Obviously, the challenges to a comprehensive model of postmodernism are <br />daunting." (end quote)<br /><br />It is probably futile trying to work out a comprehensive model of postmodernism. <br /><br />CHG wrote. <br />"Do we need such a model? Do we still need the word?" (end quote)<br /><br />Interesting questions. All those labels can only be approximations (the German term is "Annäherungswerte") anyway. <br />On the other hand, what would we do without those labels? <br /><br />So if we treat labels while being aware of their only limited use, there is room for flexibility.Trafonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1262631126788882699.post-60242837444271727962012-06-18T01:48:51.033-07:002012-06-18T01:48:51.033-07:00KK wrote:
"A primordial knowing (or truth) ...KK wrote: <br /><br />"A primordial knowing (or truth) deep within us that has been covered up by ages and ages (layers and layers) of false thinking and inhibition (conditioning) that have made it silent.<br />This is how i characterize 'intuition'." (end quote)<br /><br />I see intuition as the ability to process and adequately interpret perceptual data even if one is unable to consciously analyze why one feels that way about a person or issue. Hence the term "gut feeling". <br />Intuition probably has a lot to do with mirror neuron reaction.Trafonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1262631126788882699.post-30701990160017015592012-06-14T00:25:28.450-07:002012-06-14T00:25:28.450-07:00An interesting blog post on genealogy in Agamden: ...An interesting blog post on genealogy in Agamden: http://www.politicaltheology.com/blog/?p=2276abbeysbooksnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1262631126788882699.post-47176145056040824612012-06-13T12:25:58.905-07:002012-06-13T12:25:58.905-07:00These acts, gifts, trades etc are a thorny philoso...These acts, gifts, trades etc are a thorny philosophical issue. Nietzsche in the beginning of Genealogy says that man was first a calculating man, a man who traded, an economic man. He is disgusted by "this man" who is an exchanger. So here we can read Rand reading Nietzsche, memorizing him by heart, not quite aware of this implication - she is only a schoolgirl of 16 - but later we will see in her novels, especially Atlas, that she glorifies this "exchanger man" who produces wealth instead of just consuming it. We can read her as a "negatively suggestible" personality if we want to go into psychology, as she swims against the current current of her environment - Russia, the US - and she, of course, must go toe to toe and head to head with her mentor Nietzsche. She must "best" him. Alas even Heidegger felt he couldn't. At the end of his life he said, "Nietzsche ruined me." Babich reads that statement differently and her reading is convincing.<br /><br />Just as I read Jesus's final words, "Oh my God why hast thou forsaken me" not as a statement of despair. I have forgotten exactly which psalm begins this way - the 24th, 25, 26, - somewhere around there - which a Bible student pointed out to me. It was to give courage to his watching disciples NOT to despair, to go on, to believe. and then we have Job.<br /><br />More Zizek last night. On the self. The self as non-existent, as socially constructed then frozen. I see the statement as akin to The Inscription of the Body (NIetzsche, Foucault, Baudrillard, Butler, Malabou) but the IOTB<br />takes in the mind also, and is not the mind where we conceive of self?<br /><br />Eric Packer loses his clothes all day. The well-known chapter in William<br />James History of Psychology on the self is a very long involved<br />dissertation of the construction of the self. Clothes being a very<br />important part.<br /><br />Unfortunately or fortunately now that I have stopped tearing my fingernails<br />off over that self thread, I have been able to think about it more in a<br />contemplative way. And then of course, that part in Zizek's Hegel popped up<br />as I opened the book at random, which is the way I am reading it for now.<br />There is much in it that resonates with you, so I am marking the pages<br />(already it is a mess) with your name to cite them for you. Right now<br />Amazon whips it new, free shipping. It will never get cheaper unless<br />someone spills something on it and decides to sell it cheap. I've seen it<br />happen and it can be a long wait for that perfect opportunity.abbeysbooksnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1262631126788882699.post-38965333293202004752012-06-13T11:44:30.713-07:002012-06-13T11:44:30.713-07:00I am curious about acts, trades, gifts that are do...I am curious about acts, trades, gifts that are done without our own awareness of our own expectation. Something we do automatically or instinctually with no thought involved. Pet the dog or nurse the baby. We dont think "What satisfaction will this give me?" the way we do when we buy a car.<br />So when we are unaware of our expectation, then does it exist?<br />I think it does exist but not as consciously forumulated thought. It's more something that is bilogically hardwired in us. When for example children l children see a pet e. g. a Puppy dog, pupy guniea pig, they have the instinctive impulse impulse to gently touch and stroke it.Trafonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1262631126788882699.post-53361686580024637172012-06-12T15:03:13.231-07:002012-06-12T15:03:13.231-07:00Well racism he may espouse. But Foucault talks abo...Well racism he may espouse. But Foucault talks about racism in a broader sense to include the old, the disabled, all those who are confined within certain spaces without knowing they live in confinement.<br /><br />I haven't read very much of Steiner, but I do like the Waldorf curriculum as I have read it in a Waldorf teacher's book. The Waldorf people I have met I have not been overly impressed with, but I have felt their spirituality. Perhaps that's the wrong word. They are sensitive to certain nuances "regular" people don't seem to know exist. But I have found them in la la land when dealing with ordinary reality. Like "jumping" your car with clips when you have let the battery go dead.abbeysbooksnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1262631126788882699.post-61531315755561994052012-06-12T14:53:07.274-07:002012-06-12T14:53:07.274-07:00Janet wrote:
"Your husband? That's like ...Janet wrote: <br />"Your husband? That's like old women saying, "I can't use a computer, but my grandchildren can>" <br />(end quote) <br /><br />My husband is a good deal more spiritually inclined than I am. He is much further advanced in that field. <br /><br />As fo me, I don't feel inclined to read any Hesse, at least not in the near future. <br />And don't get me started on the terrible Rudolf Steiner, who was, what few people seem to be aware of, a racist.Trafonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1262631126788882699.post-56856612640820911792012-06-12T14:35:08.433-07:002012-06-12T14:35:08.433-07:00Your processing feels like you are squishing cooke...Your processing feels like you are squishing cooked vegetables through a strainer to puree them into something digestible.<br />When I wrote process-oriented, I didn't have the image in mind of me processing something, instead I had in mind me being 'in the process' of getting acquainted with Zizek's writings, words, personality, etc. <br />I have the feeling that this is going to have some kind of trigger effect on my thinking; it makes me curious what kind of effect it will be. <br />These are the "gifts" I have often gotten from discussion opponents: New doors open for me. That's why I like exchanges and debates with people who don't sing from the same hymn sheet. <br /><br />As for Zizek, I get the impression of a tornado-like type. Where to start with such a philosopher is quite a challenge. <br />I think I'll start where I can relate, for example with what he said about about Hitchcock films, as I'm quite a fan of Hitchcock.Trafonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1262631126788882699.post-9070990486810497302012-06-12T13:54:51.257-07:002012-06-12T13:54:51.257-07:00Your husband? That's like old women saying, &q...Your husband? That's like old women saying, "I can't use a computer, but my grandchildren can>" <br /><br />For all by the name of what's holy, read it. Read Ivan Illich, Kozol, and there's a great new article by foucault. I need to get my review of Paper Clips up. Waldorf Schools?abbeysbooksnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1262631126788882699.post-38253301280455554632012-06-12T13:53:28.973-07:002012-06-12T13:53:28.973-07:00No. Rand was a post modernist in her thinking. She...No. Rand was a post modernist in her thinking. She just didn't know it. By default.<br /><br />I don't get this impression at all about Rand being postmodernist.<br />Her thinking is very much in black and white, and how the fantasy in AS ends, with the "good guys" winning in the end - this too is very much in black and white, and her "we are going back to the world" phrase has a touch of childlike naivete about it. She almost sounds there like the child kind she one was and who never stopped loving Cyrus, the brave hero of the adventure stories she enjoyed so much.Trafonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1262631126788882699.post-48981609581811355742012-06-12T13:36:35.201-07:002012-06-12T13:36:35.201-07:00Janet wrote:
"Oh and his one on education Be...Janet wrote: <br />"Oh and his one on education Beneath the Wheel I loved so much." <br /><br />That's another one by Hesse which my husband too liked very much.Trafonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1262631126788882699.post-57446955492478237512012-06-12T12:32:34.156-07:002012-06-12T12:32:34.156-07:00So beautiful a poem selma. Wasn't there anothe...So beautiful a poem selma. Wasn't there another like this you commented somewhere? I remember it but now don't know where it is. We need to put them altogether.abbeysbooksnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1262631126788882699.post-61978709352660508192012-06-12T01:28:49.037-07:002012-06-12T01:28:49.037-07:00Googled Crow Boy, yes.
There's a Serbian poet,...Googled Crow Boy, yes.<br />There's a Serbian poet, Miroslav Antić, wrote for children in the same way the Little Prince is a book for children. They ask a lot about death lately, and now I remembered there's his Immortal Poem, I need to find the book at my parents'.<br />"If they tell you I died, this is what will happen:<br />Thousands of colorful fishes will flutter through my eye<br />And the earth will hide me<br />and the weeds will hide me<br />while I'll be flying high.<br />Remember, there are no limits<br />only temporary limits.<br />I'll be sailing above your head at dusk<br />in wind slick as silk (...)<br />Do you really think my arm,<br />my knee<br />or head<br />can turn into clay,<br />beech root or grass?<br />That some tiny secret<br />or fear<br />can tomorrow become<br />silence<br />darkness<br />and dust?<br />I am really from stars, you know.<br />All made of light.<br />Nothing in me will shorten or stifle<br />I'll just return<br />at some accidental dawn<br />to some distant sun<br />my eyes golden."<br />This is my translation, someone was smart enough to translate the whole poem here http://lyricstranslations.com/prevod-poetry/miroslav-antic-besmrtna-pesma<br />Why Žižek didn't bemoan his parents' death.curioushairedgalnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1262631126788882699.post-79531114033137083382012-06-11T14:41:36.424-07:002012-06-11T14:41:36.424-07:00Your processing feels like you are squishing cooke...Your processing feels like you are squishing cooked vegetables through a strainer to puree them into something digestible.abbeysbooksnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1262631126788882699.post-14113827137613532202012-06-11T14:33:43.459-07:002012-06-11T14:33:43.459-07:00CHG wrote:
"Why would you think that? And whe...CHG wrote:<br />"Why would you think that? And where are all these things coming from, <br />how he talks, how many showers he takes, devoid of empathy (as Rand?), <br />horrible childhood....how about continuing beyond this 'both'. Or it <br />could mean...?<br />You really like your people in neat little boxes." (end quote)<br /><br />I'm merely responding to some first impressions Zizek has made on me. It is nothing to be sorted into any box, It's not product-oriented, but process-oriented.Trafonoreply@blogger.com